i <3 Hogger! maybe its time to start lvling my dwarf hunter

Sweeet

rofl..gotta keep hogger elite, stay with tradition. u gotta have somethin besides chuck norris jokes.

I'm not going to be surprised if 2.3 ends up reunbalancing everything, and the flame war of which class is overpowered/underpowered/overnerfed/barely touched goes to a new hight... but I'll wait and see.

....Just leave my damn addons alone.

Finally. We were the only class WITH a deadzone.

with all the bufffs that hunters are getting in 2.3... with stupid things like a dispell and maybe a mortal strike effect when they were already the class that tended to dominate... yeah. OP much?

and yeah, i think there would have been a firestorm of sorts is Hogger wasn't left elite.

@spritepixie

There is no Mortal Strike, we've only been given the new and improved Arcane Shot, but as all hunters agreed, that's not what we need... Arcane Shot would definitely not help hunters because it's not the main problem hunters encounter in them
The main problem is deadzone/LoS and it can't be overcome once an enemy figures out he can simply run around pillars...
For example a druid runs around the pillar, he is resto specced. If a hunter runs for him, he can't do *** because he's either in deadzone or melee range once he gets to him. If it's a rogue/mage, he can normally dps the resto druid.
Also, if you say this is gonna make hunters overpowered, then you got no clue about hunter problems in arena... The deadzone renders us totally useless... Have you even seen the top arena team charts? Hunters are the LEAST REPRESENTED CLASS IN 2 OUT OF 3 ARENA SEGMENTS!...
If that doesn't tell you something..

blitz,

Everybody got "deadzones", it is just in a different way than hunter's deadzone. If a rogue is about 30 yards away from a hunter, what could the rogue do but vanish / sprint?

What can the hunter do in the deadzone? Yes, a hunter can lay a trap, shatter shot (marksman), Intimidation (beastmastery), bestial wrath (removes whatever made you be in the deadzone) or attack with the pet. I wouldn't call that "nothing you can do".

Hunters' new dispel effect on arcane shot can help them alot. Think of dispelling a druid's rejuvenation or a priest's renew, or a mage's frost shield, or.. whatever buff that help your enemy. And if you consider the mortal strike-aimed shot, healers would suffer even more, as they heal 50% of normal, and get their HoTs dispelled. (in PvP situations.)

for raiding, i gratulate hunters, as in 2.3 new quivers and ammo poaches will be availbile (24 slots) and the improvement will help them to aid their raidgroup, but in pvp hunters will be too overpowered.

(atleast remove the stealth + pet bug! i hate when i stealth and i still get followed by a pet)

@trysor

I totally understand what you mean, but Blizzard has to do something, hunters obviously have/had too much trouble in arenas, with deadzone causing pretty much all of them. Also, Vanish and Sprint are both trainable skills, whilst the only hunter trainable skill you mentioned (for use in the deadzone) was the trap, and traps don't have such a radius (it's been decreased long ago, it won't trigger on 5yds).

The only change that'd cause the same effect as deadzone removal would be making scatter shot a trainable skill, but Blizzard has chosen to remove the deadzone (I'd be satisfied with scatter shot, seeing as I'm not a MM hunter).

About the stealth + pet "bug", if I recall correctly Blizzard confirmed it's working as intended, only the vanish + pet bug was actually a bug.

I smell a hunter hotfix incomming after this, I am however not screaming nerf until I see what happens with them. And yes, hotfix, not rebalancing next patch. Im a warlock, so I wont be comming in screaming nerf on your forums, I know how that feels like.

I dunno, removing the deadzone seems fine, maybe even the dispel, but the aimed shot, dont think so.

Is it counterspellable/spellockable btw? Its not right?

Oh well, blizzard usually knows what they are doing, except for their attempts at balancing SL/SL, nerfing affliction ftl.

"....Just leave my damn addons alone. "
all i really care about lmao
on a side note i do think ranged attacks need thier min range to be reduced i vote 5 yards since thats where melee ends. then either MS effect or dispell but not both i play a resto druid i would hate this

"Everybody got "deadzones", it is just in a different way than hunter's deadzone. If a rogue is about 30 yards away from a hunter, what could the rogue do but vanish / sprint?"

Now, rogue isn't "everybody", you know. And before you start saying "but but, warrior!" to try and pull out the 'trumph' I would point at the other classes called shaman, druid, priest, warlock, mage.

Notice anything? All these classes I pointed at have equal range as hunters on skills, yet got no deadzone on them.

You can stick your comparison of range issues between a melee class and a ranged class up where the sun doesn't shine, and try and actually make comparisons that matter instead. Namely that being comparisons between ranged classes, and the hunter were the only ranged class with a deadzone.

Add to this almost nonexistant burstdamage in TBC compared to other dps-classes, weaker CC abilities than other classes and less utility as well, and you start seeing a class that is almost broken in arena. When people get to choose which classes they want in their team, hunter is usually far far down the wish-list of what the team wants to be ablt to compete with other teams.

"Now, rogue isn't "everybody", you know. And before you start saying "but but, warrior!" to try and pull out the 'trumph' I would point at the other classes called shaman, druid, priest, warlock, mage."

Most of these classes have what we call "casting times" and "silence/interrupt" that is the "deadzone for those classes. You try long casting spells when you have people in your face. Yes, we do have instant cast spells for those purposes...like you have a pet, wing clip, scatter shot, traps, etc.

Lack of deadzone will fix one or two peoplems hunters had against rogues, but as per usual, that "fix" will totally overpower them against alot of other classes.

WOOOOOT!!!

Haha. I wondered how long it would take for the crying to start on this.. lmao

if you read the whole post then the first thing was that they were considering a Mortal strike effect on Aimed Shot, which is why i said "maybe." and i don't have a big problem with the removal of the deadzone.

But all these things combined with the fact that you'll be able to see all beneficial buffs your enemy has once this patch goes live does make for an OP hunter.

Im a hunter, been a hunter since beta and my eyes are both ways on this. I've always yearned for a decrease in minimal attack range. Though, sometimes when i think about it, thats one way to made a hunter not kick the **** out of you. Alas, we'll see and blizzard USUALLY knows what their doing :D

blitz,

I've used insane amounts of Vanish just to remove pets from my *** after patch 2.2 and 2.2.2, so whatever blizz say, it still occur. (But it seems hunters don't -use- the bug as much as they did, but warlocks love doing it).

But pets are so cute! I feel really loved when i get jumped by those tiger cubs :)

dietx,

I think the deadzone did add something for hunters. thats right, add. If you pve, you don't usually bother about the deadzone, as you normally stand at a decent range anyway.

But in pvp, the deadzone made hunters aware of close targets, so that they focus more on them than units futher away and then started to kite. Kiting is not as easy if your oponent do got skills as it usually look like. kiting often make you think of your next move. What are you doing next? where should you kite him? Do i just run into death if i go like this? So by removing the deadzone, hunters no longer need the same amount of "skill" to kite people, as concussive shot will be there for you when the target gets too close etc.

I think the deadzone separate good hunters from less skilled hunters. There are those that handle it and those that give up once the oponent gets within the 5-8 yards range.

Absolutely. As a mage I know that this will cause an effect for it to be easier for hunters to hunt casters, while we will have to come up with new combos/ ideas on how to kill them at our usual distance. We wear only cloth and we all suck in melee. Dps? yeah ok.. but honestly if you have someone in your face hackin at you as well as stunning, pet, etc... what does that matter? The deadzone gives perspective, as im sure it has for quite awhile. Plenty of seasoned hunters out there have mastered the art only hunters can really do the best, Kiting. If your gong to strengthen one class, you should do so to all. Those playing hunters will quite obviously be biased towards this, many of those that look to this as a positive change.. and they should; its only natural to gravititate towards an easier way of doing things.

Claiming hunters don't got cast times on their attacks is ignoring TBC hunter Mechanics. Hunter instant attacks do crap damage and have cooldowns. Not to mention there aren't that many of them. The big change in hunter mechanics made steady shot be up to 40% of a raiding PvE hunters damage output (a scenario where there aren't anyone hitting on the hunter as it has cast-time). Take 40% of the output as autoshot and 20% as pet damage (rough estimates, but acurate enough in broad figures). Of these, only the pet can be used while moving. So neither autoshot or steadyshot ar really something that you can rely on for damage output in PvP where you are both hit with attacks and need to keep moving.

That said, the deadzone is still not melee range, hunters will still not be able to use ranged attacks in melee range, it is just the area between melee range (5 yards) and ranged (8 yards) where hunters previously could do jack-all while every other ranged class could just cream hunters from whle receiving damage only from the pet.

If I had a dime for the amount of times I had to throw up my hands in the air at disgust of being unable to do anything at all because a mage yet again frostnovaed me and my pet and stood in my deadzone killing me without giving me any way of fighting back, I would be a rich man now.

They put diminishing returns on stuns because they reliased it was not fun not having control over your character and not being able to actually fight back. Deadzone abuse have by now reached a level where it prevented hunters from this very thing (fighting back).

We still only got our regular weak attacks in melee that didn't scale to match health levels in TBC, and if you fear 600 hit raptorstrikes every 6th second in melee, your issue isn't with the hunter class, it's with your extremely crap gear. We're still the lowest damage dealing ranged DPS class when it comes to melee range, even after deadzone is gone. We still bring less utility to an arena team than any other dps class.

Frankly, I'm having a hard time to see what people are crying about. But I guess people will always cry when their previously free honorkills actually get some degree of chance to fight back, now that they can't just move into the black hole the deadzone curently is for hunters and kill hunters un-opposed.

As for the skill issue... Statistics have proven again and again that hunters are just not desired on equal basis with other classes in arena. Given the nature of people to wanting a competitive setup, this must mean that the hunter is just not seen as being a competitive class in arena. Skill has nothing to do with the perception of people, class balance has everything to do with it.